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slower computers, please 

I'm a computer guy, but I'm very much over fast computers. Most of your computer's resources are wasted loading ads and trackers on webpages. Video games require more and more power to deliver less interesting experiences. Don't get me started on cryptocurrency. Computers are getting increasingly complex, therefore less reliable, nearly impossible to repair, wasteful, and devastating to the environment. We need and more

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit Have you seen people on here discussing permacomputing? There are some overlapping values and thoughts there.

viznut.fi/texts-en/permacomput

#permacomputing

slower computers, please 

@cstanhope this is great! Thanks.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit I'm quite convinced my 2007 MacBook would still be sufficient for most web tasks if not for surveillance capitalism.

re: slower computers, please 

@vkc Having used a similar-era iMac until its power supply quit about a year ago, I found that it could not handle most Web tasks.

Great for scripting and terminal-based browser tasks. Not even overly slow compiling large LaTeX documents.

But browsing just comletely overwhelmed it.

@thezerobit

slower computers, please 

@vkc @thezerobit

Refurbished laptops are just as good :agoogle100: 💻

slower computers, please 

@vkc @thezerobit My browser has been my largest resource hog (both memory and cpu) for over a decade now. And I compile quite a lot of code and run computationally intensive simulations... yet it's still my browser that consumes more than half of the cpu time and thus energy.

slower computers, please 

@attilakinali @vkc @thezerobit Indeed. The 10 browser instances I run on a daily basis suck up all of my memory, and next is JetBrains. My i5-4590 has more then enough juice, but I need 16GB-32GB of RAM to be effective at work.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit I had the pleasure of having a g3 imac in action all day a few weeks ago. Streaming internet radio AND playing sim city and browsing frog find and other apps simultaneously. It was amazing. Just a pure computing and online experience before computing and technology just became an interface to ads and trackers. Take me back to 99 calgon.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit I spend so much time wondering how I could build a $1000 computer and yet somehow a web browser can use all of my available resources

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit I wouldn't say it's true all the time, but usually when I find myself wanting a faster computer it's so that I can run a web browser, usually Firefox, at a tolerable level of responsiveness.

slower computers, please 

@toroidalcore
Install a plugin that blocks 3rd party trackers and everything will run much faster. Not a full solution, but it helps a lot. Disabling JavaScript helps on pages that don't need it (blogs, news sites). Use a dedicated email client instead of bloated Gmail. Almost none of the massive computing requirements for webpages are justified for what you get, which is usually just some images and text that could have been rendered on a 20 y.o. machine.

re: slower computers, please 

@thezerobit I'm running Firefox on an older Thinkpad right now, and just starting up and navigating the settings it's a little sluggish. On my newer laptop it's zippier.

I do agree about web page bloat, though, it's fast navigating slimmer pages once it gets going. I rarely even bother with Gmail's web interface, even on my faster machine.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit well, in my case none of my computers are anywhere near brand new. I use a Z400 Lenovo that can't run modern games but I don't see any good reason to upgrade this 8 years old computer

slower computers, please 

@ffuentes
Same, my personal laptop is 7 years old and works just fine for anything I need it for.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit - I currently have two desktop computers: A) a Raspberry Pi 4B w/8GB of RAM, and B) a 2011 Dell Inspiron 570 w/4GB of RAM running Ubuntu. Both nicely handle everything I need (web browsing, writing, photo editing, watching video). Also have a second older Dell running FreeBSD as a home server w/2GB RAM. Yes, older computers work very well.

slower computers, please 

@sky_scat
Yeah, people go into Best Buy looking for a computer, and end up spending a $1000+, when they would get by just fine with a $65 Raspberry Pi.
My mom needed a "new" computer a few years ago, so I picked up a used desktop on craigslist for $80 that ran Windows + a web browser just fine. She was prepared to spend hundreds of dollars and all she does is check email, read some articles and store some photos.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit computers are not more complex then they where 10 years ago. It's still the same architecture. So repairing a computer ( the hardware it is ) is not more difficult. From the software side it is become more difficult to repair indeed but there is good reason for that too. Virusses are more advanced so Windows (or any other is) needs to be more advanced too, go stay a head of the virusses

slower computers, please 

@kzimmermann @thezerobit HEVC is doing a pretty good job reducing movie file size and AV1 looks pretty darn promising as the next step forward.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit
It's not the hardware that's the problem, it's the software devs who use electron for every damn GUI.

Or projects like webpack that bundle megabytes of unnecessary libs to make a blog and require 2GB of RAM to do so

#softwareObesity #lazyDev

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit I don't think we need #retrocomuting, except for nostalgia and to learn from it, especially how to write software. It is mindblowing how bad software developers are comparing to the 1970s and 1980s.
Cobol-projects from the 1970s are still maintained today because the people who started it knew what they are doing. I want to see (or better not) what will happen to all the projects in Java.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit I'm a fellow retrocomputer fan but I do enjoy the speed when I'm editing videos, large images and running intensely complex computations. The future does have its perks.

I do get agitated when something that worked fine with 4MB of RAM suddenly needs over a gigabyte because it's running on Electron tho.

slower computers, please 

@polychrome @thezerobit I could IM with people with some IRC client, Bitlbee as a proxy against IM protocols and some term under a crappy ARMv5 CPU (comparable to an Intel Pentium I@233-II@350) comparable). Years before, I could chat, do inline videos on chats, math, images and videoconferences on a shitty Athlon and 256MB of RAM with Kopete. And that with the so-called bloated KDE3 desktop. Today something similar requires 8GB of RAM to run well. No, not for 4K, with 4K I’d expect to be reasonable to have 4GB of RAM. It’s required for something like 1280x720 video streams on chats. Crazy.

slower computers, please 

@polychrome Yeah, video editing is a legitimate use of modern fast computers, but then again, the ever-increasing resolutions are not really worth the computing cost, IMO. Like, I would give up 4K60 content, if it meant the planet would remain habitable. No shade on what you do. 95% of people are using their personal supercomputers to scroll FB and read news articles.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit

It isn't even just all that Browser-bloat.

i.E. software-development: back in the Days Delphi6 had ALL the features you could wish for. Only thing against it, was how horribly slow it was. Starting it took like more than a minute!

20 years later, we have still the same features in similar IDEs, at the same speed. Only we now need 32+GB RAM and some current CPU to do it.

slower computers, please 

@drazraeltod
Delphi was pretty amazing. I worked for a company that used Delphi 5 to build their core app, and it was done by a single programmer using a Pentium 3 with 256 MB of RAM and a CRT monitor. Programming the same thing nowadays would happen in the browser and it would take 5 people with beefy computers.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit With http://brutaldon.org I could answer to your post even under a 486 and 8MB of RAM with Lynx :p. Some Unix guy made a program which did Engineering level calculations in C much faster (by implementing good algorythms) than Nvidia with CUDA and Python doing the same task for five months. Go figure. Current programmers know nothing on optimizations. And free C manuals (FSF/GNU licensed) are readily available for everyone. Emacs and M-x calc + gnuplot can do lots of calculation even under a Pentium II. It’s just laziness and ignorance.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit i hate this too, think of how much money gets wasted on new desktop computers so they can run progressively slower versions of MS Office and Windows.

slower computers, please 

@snickerbockers
It's absolutely by design. Software and hardware vendors working together to keep inflating computing needs to keep generating cash by forcing the "obsolescence" of perfectly capable hardware and software, so they can keep printing money.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit What we need is not faster computers. What we need is software designed for slow computers.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit We need to make better use of the capacity we have. Do that and your machine will last longer, use fewer resources and yes, likely they’ll be slower in the near future than they otherwise would need to be. Slower as a consequence, not a goal.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit If I can't figure out how it works by opening it with a screwdriver and fiddling with a multimeter, it's too complicated.

slower computers, please 

True that. Most of the games around (specially tripple A) are just boring. Sure they look cool but gameplay it’s just the same thing wrapped in different textures and objects. I remember playing MUD’s and even now when I login to play a bit it amazes me how much I right away get pulled in. We have the best graphic cards in our heads, pity we use it less and less. The only thing missing is players. muds these days are pretty empty while they were all based on human interaction.

Same with web. Take a look at gemini. The text only experience makes everything so much faster and more interesting. People instead of narrowing down content to short attention span requirenments, actually write interesting stuff worth reading. With the limitation to just text, getting your page to load nice asccii art makes it interesting and creative. Not to mention all the web apps that chew your resources. Simple chat app that slows down your computer for essentially passing text from one person to the other…..

slower computers, please 

@muppeth
Yep. I don't think most people actually care that the graphics are ever-so-slightly more realistic with each iteration. I invited my brother-in-law over the other night and we played Atari 2600 games together and had a blast. I love the idea behind gemini. I need to spend more time with it. I've been thinking about blogging again, and I think that seems like that is the ideal technology.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit and faster programming… You’re phone is using the equivalent of a 1985 supercomputer, to process text messages, the ZX-spectrum could process.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit I miss the print queue being slow enough to interrupt jobs before they printed when you realized you’d made a mistake.

@thezerobit with you 100%. I'm a "glass is twice as big as it needs to be" person. Most of my stuff runs on R-Pis and they're still too big. I'm planning to rewrite a couple of my business systems to run on an ESP32 when I get a little spare time. More than enough power for time tracking and billing

@radicalabacus
Very true. Raspberry Pis are pretty over-powered, and I don't understand why they keep making them more powerful. The model 1 is perfectly fine for running a lightweight Linux desktop or RISC OS.

@thezerobit Yeah; it's a vicious cycle. Typical PCs get faster, so developers get more wasteful, so even small machines like the Pi expand to try to run the wasteful software. Maybe I'm just getting old, but it doesn't seem right to me that mind bogglingly powerful computers are mostly used for the same stuff we were doing in the 90s with 8Mb of RAM

@radicalabacus
It's not that we're getting old, it's that because we're "old" we know things can be different. It's perspective. :)

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit they should be a general tool that you can run in to simulate at how programs behaves when things are bad.

I.e. slow-ass filesystem. (perhaps one that gets full?) (from sshfs with shitty connections, it seems i.e. zsh does not like it) a slow-down proxy. And a slow RAM/CPU..

slower computers, please 

@jasper
Yeah, part of the problem is that web developers use $3000 computers to develop applications that run fine on their system. Simulating slow systems is a good idea for getting software that performs well in limited computing environments!

@thezerobit I've been thinking about this issue and I think I've worked out a possible solution:

The goal is to make programs more efficient, not to necessarily give up on computing power. You could make this happen with a simple nag notification on your OS and browser:

"Warning: This application is consuming a lot of resources on your device."

Even if the user dismisses the message and chooses not to show it again your application has just been branded as a resource hog. Even worse - your "smooth user experience" has been interrupted and we know that UX has practically become a software developer cult.

This should cause developers to care about optimization just to get the golden UX standard of not being interrupted with that message.

@polychrome
A "why is my computer slow?" thing in the system tray that shows which programs are resource hogs is another option, but in general, I like the idea of letting users know when programs are behaving poorly.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobitd@anticapitalist.party I've found my web browsing experience has sped up dramatically since I started turning off javascript in my browser by default and using front ends for common sites like youtube and twitter would force me to use it. I very occassionally toggle it on for a site or two, but a dramatic amount of the web I care about seems to work fine and more pleasantly without js.

slower computers, please 

@thezerobit@anticapitalist.party While we at it, lets bring back sword fights and instead of money we should go back to trading instead. 🤣

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